RE: pHBD Should Be Polycub's Main Token

avatar

You are viewing a single comment's thread:

Here's something I'd never considered before, and correct me if you or any of the rest of the Leo or POLYCUB team have already spoken on the subject;

Since HBD is a derivative token (a type of financial contract whose value is dependent on an underlying asset, group of assets, or benchmark) - namely of the HIVE token, pHBD operates based on the same supply overall of HBD, just being stored or transferred on the Polygon Network?

I'm not well-versed in the software side of this, but I can definitely appreciate the amount of time and effort that has been put into both Leo & POLYCUB.

Going off this presentation, that you're proposing pHBD be THE main token, wouldn't there need to be both a dramatic increase in the supply of HIVE tokens (to mint new Hive-Backed Dollars) and then a pretty large increase in the actual supply of HBD in order to move them over to Polygon?

One thing I truly appreciate is Hive's ease of use, and LeoFinance also got it done really well.

Posted Using LeoFinance Beta



0
0
0.000
23 comments
avatar

It’s like it’s backed by something that’s backed by something that’s backed by nothing. I’m team Hive all the way, but this is getting so scammy looking to me on the HBD now used to back something else when it’s not backed by anything. I unfortunately believe HBD will not keep any peg to dollar long term. This just looks like a mess to me.

0
0
0.000
avatar

Perhaps understanding value and reserve would be helpful.

I hypothesize you think the USD is backed by nothing.

Posted Using LeoFinance Beta

0
0
0.000
avatar

so, in theory, since HBD is a derivative of HIVE, any HBD on other chains is technically 1:1 with the HIVE-native HBD tokens. Since there is pHBD, and I'd heard rumblings of creating a bHBD for BSC and even a WHBD for ETH

0
0
0.000
avatar

I just don’t see most succeeding long term. I hope I’m wrong as many friends here are staking into these. But 90% plus of these projects promising huge returns via ARP won’t make it or the ARP will come down a lot. It’s simple math.

They said could go on a long time.
I hope everyone makes bank 🍻

0
0
0.000
avatar

yeah, I'm extremely skeptical of BUSD, USDT (Tether in general) and USDC - they all have global backers who are single points of failure. And Tether is being heavily shorted now

0
0
0.000
avatar

USDC (Circle) already filed for a banking license in the US in NY. They are getting ahead of the regulatory curve.

They will then be audited and have to comply. So that might have a degree of safety to it.

Posted Using LeoFinance Beta

0
0
0.000
avatar

I guess. the main thing is, I don't trust the people at BlackRock or Circle/Coinbase to allow any competitors to take foot in the sector

Posted Using LeoFinance Beta

0
0
0.000
avatar

Derivatives are instruments which control an underlying asset, so yes you can create derivatives like p-HBD and b-HBD, and they are valuable because they are backed by and control HBD. It doesn't matter how many derivatives you create, as long as each represents and controls an HBD.

The fact that the derivatives exist on other blockchains means the market for trading the original HBD is bigger, which means increased utility. Utility is always a core component of value.

So from a financial derivative viewpoint, wider distribution and more utility of an instrument is always increases value. Utilityy of US Dollars increase their value, limitations of the utility of a currency like the Russioan Ruble, reduces it's value. Utility is a core characteristic of value for goods, services and commodities. The more markets exist for them, the greater their value.

And as long as there is no hypothecation; "multiple derivatives backed by the exact same HBD" it is not a house of cards, but a house with a firm foundation.

Posted Using LeoFinance Beta

0
0
0.000
avatar

Thanks for the response, you cleared that up for me. I've always been skeptical of derivatives, just because of what's already happened with them in the fiat world, and they've caused a ton of damage.

Obviously, I want Polygon and PolyCUB, Hive, and HBD to all grow and become what they can. HBD as a form of payment for basic goods and services would be a huge adoption catalyst in North America, like how DASH & BTC and DAI have helped with adoption in Venezuela, Argentina, and El Salvador.

Posted Using LeoFinance Beta

0
0
0.000
avatar

Your concerns are understandable. I share your concern for deratives, they can be misused, and create large problems.

Posted Using LeoFinance Beta

0
0
0.000
avatar

Yeah, especially after Lehman in 2007, and Deutsche Bank holding supposedly over $1 Quadrillion in derivatives on their balance sheets. If HBD ultimately becomes something much greater than it is today, I think that will lend a lot more confidence to the sector as a whole, and provide a potential blueprint as to how to create a "stablecoin" that doesn't die in a brutal death spiral like UST, USDD (soon) and USDT (I think is the culminating event of the current Crypto downturn).

0
0
0.000
avatar

And even with rehypothecation, that can still have enormous value, albeit in a riskier way.

With the collateralization game, we can see how chains can work well if the underlying is strong along with the other layers.

It gets to be a challenge when things do fall apart.

Posted Using LeoFinance Beta

0
0
0.000
avatar

Yes, you are right, rehypothecation generates a lot of value, so many financial concerns consider the risks worth it.

Posted Using LeoFinance Beta

0
0
0.000
avatar

Yeah. Few realize the value of a collateral chain when the underlying collateral is strong and the players pay back the loans.

It really can foster some financial growth rather rapidly.

People are right, when things go bad, it can be a mess. But that is always the case with leverage.

Posted Using LeoFinance Beta

0
0
0.000
avatar

As an algorhythmic stable HBD is back by Hive, Hive is both something and nothing, as it derives it's value from the Community.

The US Dollar is backed by the US Government, so the Dollar is both something and nothing, it derives it's value from the community wich supports it, the American Government, and the world wide community which feels it has value.

Hive and HBD are not as old as the US Dollar, but niether is backed by gold nor bitcoin, their value exists in the mind of their community.

Posted Using LeoFinance Beta

0
0
0.000
avatar

You are correct, pHBD is a derivative of HBD. The former is located on Polygon with the latter on Hive. Hence we are dealing with two separate assets.

The creation of pHBD can only come from HBD. By bridging it, that releases pHBD into the market. The HBD is still in existence in the @p-hbd wallet on Hive. Some of this is used to generate a return via the saving pool.

Ultimately, HBD is backed by $1 worth of $HIVE. This means the value of HIVE (more than just price). Over time, the value of the "reserve" can increase via utility.

As for the creation, yes conversion is one of the way that HBD can be created. To assert we need more HIVE is not necessarily true. The higher the price of HIVE, the more HBD that can be created by each one. So if $HIVE is $2, then 2 HBD can be minted for each.

There is a total outstanding supply with utility (simply to interact with the blockchain to start). However, conversion is another utility that has to be considered.

Posted Using LeoFinance Beta

0
0
0.000
avatar

OH ok, that was definitely confusing before. So, the production of new HBD tokens is solely dependent on the PRICE of each HIVE token vs the USD..so, what would happen, if, hypothetically, HIVE ran all the way to $5 USD per token, would that open the floodgates of liquidity to HBD? I know HBD is relatively tiny in comparison to the big bois, but that also gives it a more independent oversight vs something like Coinbase, Circle, BlackRock, or Paxos.

0
0
0.000
avatar

so, what would happen, if, hypothetically, HIVE ran all the way to $5 USD per token, would that open the floodgates of liquidity to HBD?

Potentially. Under that scenario, each $HIVE could convert to 5 HBD. However, the question is how many would convert?

That is where utility comes in. Those who are HODLing $HIVE for appreciation, to be able to interact with the blockchian or for governance wouldnt do a not of HBD creating.

It is why there needs to be other ways to generate it like the placement in savings as well as reward payouts.

Posted Using LeoFinance Beta

0
0
0.000
avatar

Fair enough, good response. I first heard about the Hive blockchain back in 2019, when I stumbled upon @scottcbusiness's content on LBRY when I went digging for crypto educational materials. Throughout the past 3 years, I've always maintained that Hive seems to be the best blockchain for social networking, because, not only is the price of the HIVE token not controlled solely by a small group of people, but also that you can actually earn HIVE and HBD for creating content, that was the big thing to me.

I grew up with Xanga, Myspace, and then gave up on social networking in general once Facebook took over. I never got into the trends, never used IG in its rise to dominance, never really went on YouTube except to check out basketball game highlights (no cable tv at home back then) and I never saw any possibility of making money online.

Thankfully things have changed dramatically in the past ~15 years, and there are growing opportunities everywhere, especially in the blockchain space. Not even considering there are over 100 DApps built ontop of HIVE so far, the potential for HBD being the stablecoin for Hive is just the floor, imo.

I've been a big fan of the IBC & Cosmos blockchain + ecosystem, and I see interoperability as the key to encouraging adoption and fine-tuning of UIs for the masses. In my eyes, HBD could become a stablecoin that could one day also be easily traded within the Cosmos ecosystem, within such Blockchains as Osmosis, Cosmos, Ethereum (via Gravity Bridge), and then utilized in the different Swaps like SecretSwap (for example, an sHBD token, created by bridging from Hive to the Secret Network), ButtonSwap, and SiennaSwap all based on the Secret Network.

And maybe even still, with the future advent of a bHBD, utilizing the token in PancakeSwap for LP mining as well as providing something of reasonably-stable value as an intermediary to swap from token to token. Since Tether is commonly used for that, I'd wager that HBD's best case scenario, would be supplanting Tether entirely in the decentralized space, regarding swapping from Hive to Ethereum to Cosmos to Bitcoin to THORChain to Monero, it's all possible using the same idea to build from.

Even though the LUNA debacle put the brakes on a LunaCUB application, there are still other chains that Cub DeFi could integrate with to further the flywheel-effect, becoming a true hub for DeFi for BSC, ETH, Polygon, Avalanche, HIVE, and much more!

0
0
0.000
avatar

You will likely see aHBD, ThorHBD, and maybe something on Solana.

The key is to get it built first. Duplicating on other EVMs is rather east once the main coding is done.

Posted Using LeoFinance Beta

0
0
0.000
avatar

i gotcha. So a Decentralized algorithmic-balanced stablecoin that does not have a centralized entity behind it, pulling strings and pumping liquidity in to bail it out (a la Terra).

0
0
0.000
avatar

That is correct. HBD is backed by $1 worth of HIVE.

The Hive blockchain is not controlled by one entity. Instead, the 20 consensus witnesses and the 80+ rotating ones control the chain.

And no single entity has more than 3% or 4% of the total stake,

Posted Using LeoFinance Beta

0
0
0.000
avatar

I think pHBD is a NFT representing the value of HBD on Polygon, and the existing supply of HBD depositied on exchanges and locked in Hive wallets very large curently, in excess of several million, so first this needs to be mobilized and put into circulation instead on new HBD printed. Subsequently @smooth the creator of the "HBD Stabilizer" also wrote that there was great scalability in the stabilizer to support both this mobilization and fuel the creation of a large pool of USDC-pHBD on Polygon.

Posted Using LeoFinance Beta

0
0
0.000